Becoming a Catalytic Leader by William Attaway on Leaders of Leaders Podcast with Aaron Guyett

William Attaway is a Leadership and Executive Coach for Catalytic Leadership, LLC, a company he founded to help leaders to INTENTIONALLY grow and thrive. He has served in local church ministry for over 25 years, and is currently the Lead Pastor of Southview Community Church, a church in Herndon, Virginia (near Washington, D.C.) where he has served since 2004. He holds a Ph.D. in Old Testament (with an emphasis in Biblical Backgrounds and Archaeology), and he loves to read and speak about leadership, organizational change, and building up people and teams. He's an Amazon #1 best-selling author, and his newest book is Catalytic Leadership (January, 2022). Originally from Birmingham, Alabama, William now lives in northern Virginia with his beautiful wife Charlotte and their two daughters.

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In his book, Dr. William Attaway gleans from his own personal leadership experience as well as the experience of hundreds of leaders he has coached, and he shares 12 key principles that can help leaders TODAY, no matter where they are.

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Transcript

00:00.00
leadersofleaders
Yo what's going on everybody. We are back on the leaders of leaders podcast and we've got an incredible guest for you. We're going to talk about becoming a catalytic leader with William Addaway William Addaway is a leadership and executive coach. For Catalytic Leadership Lc a company he founded to help leaders to intentionally grow and thrive. It's like we've heard that word before intentionally he has served in local church ministry for over twenty five years and is currently the lead pastor of south. View community church a church in Herndon Virginia it's near Washington d c for those of us on the west coast that have no idea where that is ah where he has served since 2004 he holds a ph d in old testament with an emphasis in biblical backgrounds and archeology which is awesome I'm really excited to. Talk to you about that and he loves to read and speak about leadership organizational change I'm building up people and teams. He's up Amazon number 1 best sellingling author and his newest book is catalytic leadership. Check it out. It. Ah published January of this year originally from Birmingham Alabama. William now lives in Northern Virginia with his beautiful wife Charlotte and their 2 daughters William. Thank you so much for hopping on the show.

01:26.46
William
Aaron thank you so much for having me. It's an honor to be here.

01:30.27
leadersofleaders
Yeah, so ah, let's just jump right into it. What is catalytic leadership to a person that wrote a book about it.

01:36.33
William
You know it actually it actually comes out of my own story I went to to college as a pharmacy major and I got through you know, general chemistry and inorganic chemistry I got to organic chemistry and decided that you know this is.

01:42.19
leadersofleaders
Stop and.

01:53.12
William
This is not really what I want to do for the rest of my life and I change directions as many do but in my brief chemistry studies I discovered the power of a catalyst a catalyst is something that you'll introduce into a mixture to incite or to accelerate significant change.

01:54.38
leadersofleaders
A a.

02:12.94
William
Action and I'd been a student of leadership for a number of years at that point and and I thought you know all the great leaders that I've studied about or learned from they would resonate with that definition something that you introduce to accelerate or to incite significant change.

02:20.57
leadersofleaders
A.

02:30.55
leadersofleaders
So.

02:31.11
William
To make an impact and for the last thirty plus years I've been watching and learning and and been a student of leadership I've been a practitioner of leadership for over twenty five years now both in the business world and in the local church and one of the things that that I've been working on is. Identifying what makes a leader catalytic. What makes them that leader that's going to make a difference. It's going to make a real impact that's going to incite or accelerate significant change and what makes a leader more mediocre. You know mediocrity doesn't really inspire anybody.

02:51.62
leadersofleaders
I.

03:03.41
leadersofleaders
And.

03:09.55
William
And yet too many leaders I'm afraid find themselves square in that camp.

03:12.85
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, and what's interesting is they I feel like some of those mediocre leaders are leaders that oversee and lead a lot of people. Unfortunately right I mean that's.

03:25.69
William
Yeah, yeah, it's true.

03:31.29
leadersofleaders
From my perspective. That's that seems to be the the case. Um, yeah, So so obviously yeah I understand catalyst when it comes to the chemical reactions right? Agitate excite? Um, So what would be. What would be something that someone could take away right now here in the beginning of this talk um and be like man. That's a that's a pretty solid nugget to help me see am I like am I a catalytic catalyst am I A catalytic leader am am I. Doing this thing right? am I agitating or exciting and getting creating impact creating change or am I mediocre how how would somebody see that and if and if okay I'm not what could be something that I could institute right now I could I could put into. Um, action right now to help me at least journey towards that um position journey towards that leadership level.

04:38.26
William
That's a great question aon I think the to and answer to your first question. How do you know? if you're catalytic I think you look in the mirror and you say you ask yourself am I making the difference that I know I'm capable of making.

04:41.80
leadersofleaders
Hey.

04:49.81
leadersofleaders
A.

04:52.31
William
And I'm making the impact that God put in my heart to make and if you are fantastic Then then you're probably right in line with that. Keep going That's fantastic but too many leaders would answer that question a little differently. They might answer it. Well not yet or.

04:59.53
leadersofleaders
A.

05:09.70
William
I Maybe I used to be I felt like I was on the track but I got off I kind of you know, went into a ditch or for whatever reason I'm not making the impact I'm not leading with a level of significance that I know God put in my heart to do.

05:14.12
leadersofleaders
And yeah.

05:26.25
William
If you want to make a difference if you want to make an impact what I did in the book is is capture 12 of the principles that I've seen in catalytic leaders both from my study my own journey and from the hundreds of leaders that I've coached over the last twenty plus years and there are threads that have run through all of those conversations. No matter where you lead.

05:32.56
leadersofleaders
And.

05:43.86
leadersofleaders
And.

05:46.30
William
I've I've coached government leaders I've coached military leaders educational leaders small business leaders csuite leaders church leaders. The principles are the same and if there's 1 thing you want to do 1 thing you want to take away. This is what I hope you take away from this.

05:55.10
leadersofleaders
A.

06:03.82
William
The very first principle that I talk about is what I call the non-negotiable of catalytic leadership and that is to choose to have a teachable spirit that is a daily choice that you and I get to make every one of your listeners gets to make.

06:18.42
leadersofleaders
Newan man.

06:20.57
William
Am I going to choose to be the most teachable person in the room in whatever room I'm in in whatever conversation I'm in in whatever situation I'm in am I going to choose to be the most teachable person am I more concerned with what I'm going to say or am I asking twice as many questions. As I am making statements you and I get to make that choice make that decision every single day and if we will make that choice and say I'm going to intentionally choose to be teachable if we'll make that choice that will make a bigger impact than just about any other leadership decision. You will make this week.

06:43.29
leadersofleaders
A.A.

06:57.37
leadersofleaders
Man It's so good. Yeah I think even just that Ah, when if you reframe with you know am I teachable or am I not teachable and if I'm not okay, how can I become more teachable that changes so much right is like.

07:09.27
William
Yeah.

07:14.66
leadersofleaders
Jeez so we're unapologetically disciples of in and with Jesus Christ here on leaders of leaders. Um, and yeah, right? and and obviously you run a local church it's a Christian Church so you are as well. How how would you.

07:21.86
William
Good me too.

07:34.56
leadersofleaders
Coach somebody who's discipling in Christ to to allow their spirit to be teachable by Christ and I'm guessing by Christ through the holy spirit scripture I mean we can go a bunch of different directions with that I guess but um.

07:44.78
William
Home.

07:53.60
leadersofleaders
But just curious there and I'm I I'm going to try to figure out a way to like hop into your archeology old testament stuff. We're not there yet. But I was like oh what to talk about that a little bit. So yeah, ah, but yeah, but if I'm a disciple of Christ and I don't have a teachable spirit. How how am I going to adjust my or reframe or change my worldview or you know whatever it is so that all right lord teach me what it is that I need to be doing and and who I who I am in you and how I interact with the world.

08:31.11
William
I think we first have to understand that a teachable spirit is not something you either are born with or you're not well sorry I don't have one I guess I won't have one for the rest of my life now it is a choice you get to decide whether you're gonna have this or not. That's the first thing to bear in mind.

08:31.16
leadersofleaders
Around me.

08:36.82
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

08:42.41
leadersofleaders
A.

08:49.30
William
A second I would say remember that you can learn from anybody in any situation sometimes you learn what not to do that that can be incredibly valuable So don't discount well in my situation where I with my boss or with my team member. My sp. Okay, you know.

08:55.90
leadersofleaders
M.

09:07.52
William
No, you can learn from anybody. Okay, if you have the right teachable spirit now what's the biblical rationale for this I mean everything I teach every leadership principally all truth is god's truth everything is rooted in scripture. So what's the root of a teachable spirit I would take you to Paul's letter to the philippians.

09:07.54
leadersofleaders
A.

09:17.74
leadersofleaders
A a.

09:27.26
William
Right in philippians two what does he say he says that that we we look at Jesus as our example and Jesus emptied himself of all the glory all the honor that was due him and he humbled himself right.

09:30.73
leadersofleaders
A.

09:40.52
leadersofleaders
A.

09:44.34
William
Well, that's a model for you and for me what does it mean to humble myself it means to stop thinking I've got all the answers it means to understand that I need to put myself in a learning posture in a teachable posture.

09:51.80
leadersofleaders
A.

10:01.24
William
Instead of acting like I know everything when we model ourselves after Jesus that is the result you will have that spirit because that's what he modeled for us.

10:01.58
leadersofleaders
And. A.

10:14.40
leadersofleaders
Man and that's why Jesus Christ is the ultimate leader of leaders right? Yeah yeah, so good I love that? Yeah, it's that's ah, that's so true. Um, all right? So that's I mean that's pretty rock. Solid.

10:17.95
William
Greatest 1 in history.

10:32.30
leadersofleaders
Put a pin in that now I can jump into ah old testament and archeology a little bit ah out of my to to quench my own personal curiosity. What made you choose that route and specifically you know if you're a christian. And a lot of christians are like you know new testament new testament new testament like oh I don't need this old testament thing. Whatever right? I am not my perspective but I do hear it and or experience that or observe that quite a bit. Um, so that's ah I guess that's. Very loaded double question there. But so why old testament and archeology and then jump into does the old testament have any bearing and any importance as to our Christian Christ centered discipling in Christ walk.

11:24.39
William
Well I hope you got some time because those are 2 pretty big questions. Ah so let's jump in let's step in why? why did I why did I study old testament and biblical backgrounds the the short answer that is the old testament makes up nearly three fours of the bible.

11:27.90
leadersofleaders
Ah know I know I want it. Let's do it? Yeah um.

11:39.44
leadersofleaders
A.

11:42.40
William
And I don't think that's accidental I Don't think you know God just looked down. Oh oh oh yeah, well make an ignore threefours of that that I didn't really yeah, don't really care that much about that. Ah I think that we should pay attention.

11:58.11
William
To what happened there and and the fact of the matter is if we understand the old testament. The new testament makes so much more sense because the new testament is revealed in the old and the old testament is revealed in the new. it's it's 1 author through so many different.

12:03.13
leadersofleaders
A.A.

12:17.10
William
Perspective so many different authors who are pinning this but 1 ultimate author behind the whole thing to it does not change and to discount 3 force of it and say and now it's it's the grand story of god dealing with people and all of it is important.

12:17.28
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that doesn't change today yesterday or my.

12:32.17
leadersofleaders
A.

12:37.26
William
I was I was drawn to the old testament not because I don't like the new obviously Jesus I'm big big. You know, big fan in ah in a good way I think that that any new testament believer is going to be drawn to the gospels.

12:38.88
leadersofleaders
A.

12:52.64
leadersofleaders
A.

12:55.22
William
I mean Jesus is our savior he is our lord. He is our master. Of course we're going to be drawn to the gospels. But as Philip Yancey made popular what? what? exactly is the bible that Jesus read. What is the the bible that he heard going to synagogue.

12:57.38
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

13:09.85
leadersofleaders
A yeah.

13:12.80
William
Of course that's the Hebrew scriptures. That's the old testament and I wanted to understand that I wanted to understand because so much of that is so foreign to us I went to seminary not because I wanted to be a pastor I did not in fact I had.

13:19.31
leadersofleaders
A.

13:27.81
William
Worked in a couple of churches and didn't have a fantastic experience and said I want to teach I Want to learn I Want to write I'm not interested in working in a church because church people can be mean so I want to I want to I want to impact God's work in a different way.

13:44.36
leadersofleaders
A.

13:47.20
William
God had a different idea in the end I wanted to learn about the old testament firsthand. This is why I studied hebrew this is why I studied the old testament but in particular the background to the culture. the history the geography I wanted to understand how people first heard. First read what we're reading but in their context. um um I believe Howard Hendrix is right? We have to first understand what it meant then to understand what it means now. So that's what I have devoted my life to understanding to studying.

14:07.91
leadersofleaders
A yeah.

14:21.10
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah.

14:24.36
William
Want to understand that if I can understand the culture if I can dive in and put myself into a culture that is so removed from the culture that you and I live in here and by by language by Geography by values by history if I can if I can.

14:32.72
leadersofleaders
A.

14:41.38
William
Place myself in that culture as much as I can and learn how they would have received that then I believe I'm going to be able to take that and make that real for you for anybody else that I happen to be teaching and pouring into so that's that's why the old testament during me and because ah.

14:42.33
leadersofleaders
A.

14:53.76
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

14:59.10
William
Ah, believe it had so much to I believe it has so much to do with what we read about in the new testament Paul was a master of the old testament. There are so many illusions in Paul where he alludes to things in the old testament which we miss if we don't know the old testament not to mention the book of revelation.

15:05.80
leadersofleaders
yeah yeah I am oh hundred percent yeah

15:17.80
William
Which has over four hundred references to the old testament alone if we don't know the old testament we're going to miss all that.

15:23.22
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely, it's funny so I would have studied the old testament and archeology because I'm naturally a skeptic and it's like I want to I want to you know and I went through a really.

15:35.40
William
A.

15:41.96
leadersofleaders
Gnarly struggle and wrestling with my my belief and my faith and understanding my and a lot of it I was just 20 stupid years old and I thought I knew everything you know? Ah so I I mean and I'm sure all of us have experienced that to some extent. Well I just.

15:53.51
William
Okay, yeah.

16:01.62
leadersofleaders
Took it to the and degree or whatever. Ah, um, and so to hear you say that I was it was totally you totally ambush me I'm like oh I mean because it's funny your reasoning for studying it is now what I glean out of it.

16:20.10
William
Yeah, oh yes.

16:20.80
leadersofleaders
Right? It's like man this makes the new testament so much richer so much more vivid and real and palpable and beautiful and that story the story of Jesus Christ I mean if it was just a news testament. It would be a pretty rad story like a pretty cool story. Um, but with the old testament. It is literally the most incredible story ever written and it was real. It's like oh but wait. It's real.

16:48.96
William
Yeah, well, that's it. That's it mean you look at you look at Matthew's biography of Jesus does he start with once up on a time in a land far far away. You know.

16:56.75
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

17:07.84
William
No, he didn't start it like that. What does he start with he starts with a genealogy that's our favorite part of the bible and then we love genealogies. What? what? Why does he start with the genealogy because he's rooting Jesus in history. This is a real.

17:16.14
leadersofleaders
Yeah, ah.

17:21.94
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah.

17:27.25
William
Person that lived in a real time and that Genealogy is one of the richest in all of scripture because in it. We find people that we don't expect to find people that should not have been there. They don't belong there.

17:33.45
leadersofleaders
A.

17:41.30
leadersofleaders
A.

17:46.56
William
Rehab she's a canaanite I'm sorry she doesn't belong there bath sheba she was married to uriah the hittite. Oh that's not okay Tamar. Well let's not talk about what Tamar did I mean.

17:47.57
leadersofleaders
No no.

18:04.93
William
Ruth Ruth is a moabite they were cut off from the covenant people of god they weren't allowed to be a part of this and this is where Matthew begins because he's painting a picture he is. He's illustrating from the very beginning. You know what.

18:05.13
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

18:23.61
William
Jesus is for all people and you may have you may you may think Messiah is gonna gonna fit inside this box. Well good luck with that because Jesus is going to blow the walls off that box and this is going to be something way bigger than you ever imagined. How would you understand that.

18:32.29
leadersofleaders
Um, yeah, um.

18:42.48
William
Without knowing who Tamar and Ruth and bathsheba and raymar.

18:49.78
leadersofleaders
Yeah, man, that's so good. Yeah, so true. So good. Um, okay, so obviously so so far in the very few minutes decent decently studied ah understand. Ah. Biblical exegesis a bit ah understand ah the bible a bit and like you said your your catholic leadership is rooted in scripture. Um, but then you also said you know you coached military leaders. You've you've coached government leaders. You've coached business leaders organizational leaders. Ah nonprofit I'm ah ah you know the whole gamut. So if if you're if you're coaching how does that go down if you're coaching a ah ah secular atheist military general. But and I'm just.

19:26.10
William
Short.

19:41.52
William
Sure sure.

19:42.25
leadersofleaders
Making up a hypothetical What if grasshoppers had door gunners Birds wouldn't mess with them so much I get it but but just for the thought experiment right? Ah yeah for that's my marine core isms. They just come out and I can't I can't not do it. Ah anyway, so right? so.

19:49.91
William
Ah, that's good I like that.

20:01.83
leadersofleaders
How do you?? How do you approach that How does that How does that leadership coaching go on how does does the vernacular change. Um, obviously the values would remain the same The principles would be the same but how so how does that Just. Paint a picture for us and how that works how that looks um how you how you approach that and.

20:20.17
William
Sure I I connect with people where they are not where I think they should be and so most of my clients are not people of faith I'm going to connect with them where they are and what I find over time is that there are questions that come up.

20:37.79
leadersofleaders
A.

20:39.95
William
And there are questions around well where where does this come from. Where does this idea originate Why? Why do you do and say and act and think this way and those are open doors.

20:51.80
leadersofleaders
Okay, so ah I've written I'm writing I should say not even close to done I'm writing a book and I've rewritten it four times. Ah, the first couple of times it.

20:56.80
William
And.

21:05.54
leadersofleaders
You know it's a book leaders of leaders and it's like okay I'm going to kind of give my so ¢42 or whatever on on you know, leaders of leaders and um and and for me, it's like okay everything everything begins with belief system if you don't have a foundation on which you can build stuff up.

21:10.77
William
Yeah.

21:23.99
leadersofleaders
Then really, you don't have purpose. You're just making up kind of arbitrary purposes arbitrary meaning arbitrary values and and so the first couple of times I I got into to writing it I was writing it. Sort of from a ah secular academic perspective and trying to keep it as objective as possible one would and one could and you know all these things. Um and I quickly found out that well I I I personally don't believe in. Any and all of these other belief systems and for me, it became really difficult to write it from a secular perspective and I was just like no I just have I'm just going all in I'm going to be unapologetically a disciple in Christ and and lay out. You know why it is that I believe what I believe and here's the belief system. And you you must be able to articulate and justify your belief system in order to have a strong firm and maybe there maybe there's one out out there outside of Jesus Christ but from what I understand and and not just my truth but god's truth doesn't really exist right.

22:21.95
William
Yes.

22:33.98
leadersofleaders
And so that's I do find I do find it a problem with that and not that I haven't you know taught in a secular setting. Of course I've taught in secular settings and and I've given basic principles and things like that. But I find man it's it's super difficult to get to the root of some. Stuff if your belief system is way over there and my belief system is here and I and I totally appreciate. You know you are able to meet people where they're at because yeah, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna be like you know I can't just and maybe I could. Ah. With the holy spirit's power right? We wave my hand and somebody's like boom. Okay, they got the belief system now. Okay, we're off and running but that doesn't work right? We we have to have conversation and dialogue and and there's going to be disagreement and there's goingnna be content. You know, contending with with these different values and understandings and and principles. So what. How? how are you able to get and and obviously we're not going to go through all 12 principles. You can read the book for that. But how are you able to get um the choose to be teachable or you know one of the other principles across without. If they're asking for backups like oh how do you How do you Why do you know that? that's true and how do you How does that I mean how does that get walked? How does that work you know because you see obviously my struggle I can't I can articulate it. But I'm like it's like ah it's frustrating. You know.

23:51.00
William
It Yeah sure it's a great question and I think I think it's important to note that in the introduction to the book I note I'm up I'm coming from the perspective of a person of faith. That's who I am so it's not.

24:05.81
leadersofleaders
Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

24:08.55
William
You know something? that's hidden that no one knows if you go to my Linkedin profile it says. Yeah I'm a a leadership and executive coach I'm also a pastor you know and so this is not this is not a surprise to any of anyone who chooses to work with me. They they know that. But.

24:14.60
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, gotcha. Yeah.

24:24.75
William
At the same time I think it's important again to connect with people where they are not where I think they should be or where other people think they should be so I'm gonna start there I'm gonna start where they are you go to the take take the first chapter cultivating a teachable spirit. You know we've talked about this. Well.

24:27.30
leadersofleaders
A yeah.

24:38.45
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

24:42.41
William
I'm not bringing up Philippians too in that chapter because that's not who I'm writing to you know I'm I'm choosing to write to people who are far from God I'm choosing to write from people to people who are leading in a different perspective. So I'm writing from my perspective who I am and I think you have to write in your authentic voice.

24:45.48
leadersofleaders
A yeah.

25:01.57
leadersofleaders
Um, yeah.

25:01.90
William
But I'm writing thinking about the person that I'm writing to and when I'm coaching them I'm thinking about where they are so how can I communicate that truth in a way that they're going to receive if I just start citing bible verses to them start quoting the bible to them. They may or and not receive that.

25:11.81
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah.

25:17.24
leadersofleaders
Yeah, exactly exactly? yeah.

25:19.36
William
If they're not a person of faith. They're likely to reject it out of hand. Okay, well then that's probably not where I'm going to start then because they don't see that as ah as ah, a valid source of truth I would disagree you would disagree. But I'm not going to start there so where can I start I can start from my own experience my own leadership journey.

25:37.11
leadersofleaders
A.

25:37.27
William
Again, leading in the business world leading in the church world I've got some stories I've got some track that I can pull from coaching leaders for a couple decades Now you know I've got tons of data that I can pull from so when somebody says I'm struggling with a team member and I'm not sure they're a good fit.

25:41.53
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah.

25:54.35
William
How long do I let this go on I don't have to think very hard to start talking about hey you know it's important to to extend Grace and to listen we have to listen to our team members. But we also have to understand that trying to hold somebody when they're a bad fit.

26:05.10
leadersofleaders
M.

26:12.38
William
Ah, is just as much a disservice to them as it is to our team and so sometimes the best thing you can do is free somebody to find a better fit. That's the kindest leadership action. You can take so you know I don't I don't need to cite a verse for that. Is there a verse for that. Of course there is.

26:13.21
leadersofleaders
A I Love it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

26:30.93
William
Course there is proverbs is full of wisdom and not just proverbs Jesus is teaching again full of wisdom. But if they're not a person of faith for me to go directly there I'm I'm appealing to a source that they don't put stock in yet. Okay.

26:43.93
leadersofleaders
Yeah, well kind of yeah, kind of like Paul's encounter with the greek philosophers right? He wasn't like let me let me deuteronomy you right now.

26:49.70
William
And and this is my that's where I was going next right right in Act seventeen when Paul teaches to the to the athenians and he's he's preaching to them. Not once does he quote scripture not once there is not one old testament citation. Do you think it's cause he didn't know any.

27:04.23
leadersofleaders
Um, man, no me Yeah, because all you got to do is go anywhere else that ball wrote. Ah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

27:08.88
William
Paul Paul had memorized what we consider the old testament he had memorized it at this point in his life. He knew it all. Of course he knew it of course he could have whipped it out and just verse after verse after verse but they weren't coming from that place and he knew that would be counterproductive.

27:20.51
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

27:28.00
William
So he started where they were. He started citing their philosophers people that they respected oh okay and I think this is a model for us particularly in a post-christian world where people don't accept the authority of what we accept. They don't have a christian heritage in history that that.

27:34.61
leadersofleaders
Yep, Love it.

27:46.87
William
Many of us had growing up. They don't have the background. They don't know the stories. They don't put stock in what we do if we start trying to to talk to them from that place and make that assumption. We're going to find ourselves in a very very uncomfortable place where we're not able to connect.

27:49.73
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

28:03.74
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah I mean that's that's exactly why I'm I'm deep in the study of logic and reasoning as well as deep in the study of scripture. It's like well I mean an atheist and I can.

28:05.51
William
And we're going to be dismissed instead of being able to help them with what we know.

28:17.96
William
Yeah.

28:23.37
leadersofleaders
Rap about logic and reasoning and I can give my logical reasons for god's existence and Jesus Christ Historicity and you know all these things and it's like and we can speak the same language. But then I could build my case and and whether they agree or or disagree. You know that has more to do with the holy spirit than has to do with me right.

28:26.74
William
Yes, yes.

28:41.94
William
That's right.

28:42.51
leadersofleaders
And so yeah, that's that's that's super good. Okay, so then a writing question and man I'm hopping all over the place because you're mentioning things I'm like okay I got to put a pin in that I got to talk about I Want to ask him about that because he's got much more experience in this and I want to I want like.

28:46.65
William
Yeah.

29:00.94
leadersofleaders
I'm choosing to have a teachable spirit so I can learn and and then I'm hoping my audience gets as stoked as ah I am about it and if they don't That's fine. There will be another podcast where we'll talk about something totally different and but ah, but yeah, ah.

29:11.32
William
It.

29:17.50
leadersofleaders
So you said ah you know I'm writing to this particular audience right? and so you have ah I'm guessing you know some sort of picture in mind of of who that person is or who those people are sort of generally like here's maybe where their beliefs are they're far from God is what you said and you know there's a.

29:27.32
William
And sure.

29:35.80
leadersofleaders
Probably a bunch of things that you're thinking about um does as you write does that person change when when you're writing or is it. Okay, it's the same that person remains the same that that person that I'm writing to remains the same the entire. Um. And I say that because what I found is like oh dang it man that person changed in my mind My writing style is is different now do I need to go back or is there a reason why this can can shift from chapter to chapter or whatever that so just curious as to your own experience in writing.

30:12.75
William
That's a that's a fantastic question here. No one. No one's ever asked me that I I will I will tell you that this book was written with 1 audience in mind and that was leaders who may or may not be people of faith and so I'm writing with that perspective in mind thinking act 17 my first book.

30:18.76
leadersofleaders
A a.

30:28.73
leadersofleaders
Yep.

30:30.64
William
Was called lead leadership lessons from the not so minor prophets and I took 6 of the of the the less reknown minor prophets and pulled leadership principles that are there right there out and began to expound on them. Um, that was written with a whole different.

30:35.54
leadersofleaders
Mm.

30:42.00
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah. Oh absolutely.

30:49.21
William
Person in mind this is written to a person of faith who wants to understand is it really practical. Do I really care like is it does Jonas say anything for the twenty first century american leader and in fact, Jonas says a ton if we understand it in its proper context.

31:03.84
leadersofleaders
Oh yeah, yeah.

31:08.54
William
Um, and that's um I'm going to lean back that direction and say let's let's understand it as it was and then we can extrapolate all of these principles that are so applicable I mean I think Jonah has more to say to twenty first century american culture than just about any of the other monoprofits truly.

31:25.77
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

31:27.46
William
When we understand that Jonah is coming from a perspective of an incredibly nationalistic racist perspective and he's he's speaking from a place where I don't want people who are different than me to be in the club.

31:36.00
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

31:46.98
William
I Don't want them to be part of God's work. No yeah, right? smiteke them siteke them hard and smite them completely God Okay, um, yeah when we understand it coming from that perspective.

31:47.19
leadersofleaders
yeah yeah I want your wrath on them yesterday. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, ah.

32:06.23
William
But he's just about the elevation of his nation and really everybody else can just go to hell when we understand that well does that have any applicability at all in our modern world. Do we see that anywhere. Well, of course we do.

32:13.80
leadersofleaders
Um.

32:22.48
leadersofleaders
Yeah, absolutely.

32:25.90
William
How do we speak into it as leaders leaders have influence and we influence through what we say what we do? How we think how we lead I think scripture can inform and can guide us.

32:33.30
leadersofleaders
A a.

32:42.81
William
In how we do those things.

32:45.76
leadersofleaders
Yeah, that's that's good and I'm gonna I'm gonna oddly bring us back to the ah that picture of that person that you're writing to or that the type of person that you're writing to is is that person an actual is that person an actual person in your life or.

32:51.45
William
Yeah, yeah.

33:02.14
leadersofleaders
Is it a conglomerate combination of people that you have experienced types of people even that you've experienced in your life and the reason why I ask that is because what I find and and the reason why I tend to I have tended to jump around and I'm like man I gotta Okay, who am I writing to why am I writing this.

33:18.55
William
Right.

33:21.78
leadersofleaders
Like I'm I'm answering this person's particular that I experience that I'm you know, still friends with or still connected to or and or not connected with or or you know whatever the case might be um but I'm I'm answering you know, specific questions that man I would like these are really good questions and so I want to.

33:36.67
William
Yeah.

33:40.90
leadersofleaders
I want to actually do a deep work here and expound on why it is that you know this truth from god is is true and and why that would make I mean if Jesus Christ is the leader of leaders that would this is why that would make us a. Solid leader of leader and and once you answer that question then we can jump into the intentionality I love the intentionality because that is you know leaders of leaders a systematic approach to intentional leadership right? And so um and you are like were right there on the same page I think with that intentionality. But.

34:10.60
William
Yes, yes.

34:18.44
leadersofleaders
Go back to is that a particular person is it or people or is it a conglomerate of many peoples.

34:25.96
William
Yeah I mean I've got 2 chairs behind me and the sun's going down so it's kind of hard to see behind me in the shot right now. but but I've got 2 chairs behind me and in one of them was the chair I sat in to write that. That's where I sat and typed um and the other chair is where I imagined the other person sitting.

34:30.54
leadersofleaders
A.

34:36.54
leadersofleaders
A.A.

34:44.13
William
And so I get very specific with that I get very specific with who I'm thinking about and what that looks like sometimes it it can be. It may not be ah, an individual that I know everything about them and I'm speaking into every part of their life because that's very few people, but it's you know I know this about these these 5 people.

34:45.84
leadersofleaders
And.

34:54.31
leadersofleaders
Right. A.

35:00.98
William
Maybe it is a ah conglomeration of them. Maybe it is a ah compilation person that sits in the chair. Um, but I know I know what matters to them and I think about that like what? what do they care about? what is what are they dealing with what are the struggles.

35:03.77
leadersofleaders
A.

35:10.25
leadersofleaders
And.

35:19.26
William
That they deal with daily or weekly. Um, you know what? what are their? What are their? what is their family dealing with I want to get as real and specific as I can when I'm thinking about that person because then I can speak into those things in a more specific way. So I.

35:19.27
leadersofleaders
A. Yeah.

35:32.83
leadersofleaders
Exactly No yeah I mean and it was more just ah odd ah odd curiosity. Ah ah from a writer's perspective me being ah ah ah, a trial writer here I'm like trying.

35:36.19
William
I Don't know if that's helpful. But that's that's.

35:41.96
William
Yeah. Me too I I want to get better. But.

35:49.93
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, you right? exactly exactly right? exactly? Um, yeah, and then you read stuff like CSLewis is like why am I even doing this why why? why? ah.

36:01.57
William
It Well this this is true. This is ah dead This is true. Ah.

36:06.44
leadersofleaders
Because like he already got the prize I know what I'm doing here I'm just bumling around on paper. Ah okay, so so but but serious um and and it's it's interesting. How God uses our bumbling around on paper though right? like isn't that interesting and so um.

36:06.82
William
Ah, that's right.

36:13.19
William
Ah, that's funny.

36:20.85
William
Yeah.

36:26.30
leadersofleaders
So even though you know we're even bumbling through our existence right? and like you're doing our day best and and then we look around. We're like shoot ah I messed up you know yet again and and then you know you you find yourself repenting and and turn into the lord. Um.

36:35.72
William
Yeah.

36:44.35
leadersofleaders
So in Intentionality I wanted to to bring that up. It's in bold ah all caps right in your biography and and I love that What is an intentional catalytic leader look Like. Or or feel like or how how is that experience? What? what articulate intentionality and its importance for the catalytic leader or for the aspiring I should say Catalytic leader.

37:15.88
William
You know I've been ah a student of leadership for over 3 decades now and I've coached leaders for over twenty years and I'll tell you Aaron I have never once read about met or been a leader I've never seen one that woke up one day and said.

37:20.16
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

37:33.11
William
Hey I'm a I'm a fully mature developed leader. How'd that happen I didn't mean for that to happen. But here I am look at this. It didn't work like that right? it takes intentionality. It takes purpose purpose and it takes direction and and.

37:41.11
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

37:51.11
William
Too many leaders are simply responding to the daily grind the daily urgent and they're not being purposeful or intentional in their own development as a leader leadership is a skill. It's a gift to be sure but no spiritual gift arrives fully developed.

37:55.84
leadersofleaders
A. Yeah.

38:07.66
leadersofleaders
A.

38:10.20
William
When I started teaching I burned all those all those recordings but if they still existed and you were to compare a recording of of me teaching you know 21 I have one did I know right? I mean if you were to compare then and now.

38:18.75
leadersofleaders
Like good thing. The internet wasn't around back then? yeah yeah.

38:28.93
William
Ah, hope you would see a dramatic growth right? because I've worked on that I've intentionally tried to grow and develop that gift I've I've sought out people who will help me grow in that and I have pursued intentional development and growth that did not just happen right.

38:30.55
leadersofleaders
A a.

38:40.13
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah. A.

38:48.30
William
Didn't just do it for 25 years and then all of a sudden realized I was better. It doesn't work like that we think experience is what makes you better and that is a cute myth. But that's all it is experience does not make you any better at all.

38:52.87
leadersofleaders
Ah, yeah.

39:03.97
William
You could have experience doing something the wrong way for 20 years experience doesn't make you better evaluated experience make you better and this is why I talk so much about evaluation because I think that's where the improvement is that's where the growth is. That's where the intentionality is.

39:05.86
leadersofleaders
No yeah.

39:11.95
leadersofleaders
A yeah. A.

39:22.31
William
You've got to be so intentional in how you grow as a leader where do you where are you now where do you want to be what is your plan to get from here to there. You get to decide that and every day you are going to either take a step in the direction of where you want to go or.

39:33.23
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

39:41.49
William
You're going to slide the other direction toward mediocrity you get to decide that.

39:43.98
leadersofleaders
Um, yeah, yeah that that's that's really good the well and if you if you if you came fully formed and I came fully formed as leaders. What are these books doing in behind. Why did you need all those.

39:59.30
William
Um, ah seriously right? ah.

40:01.49
leadersofleaders
Books then? ah, ah, um, so so then you yeah so you talk and and you know let's be let's be honest, leadership is not um, it's not perfectly. It's not perfectly measurable, right? It's not a quantitative metric. It's like yep.

40:15.46
William
Right.

40:20.40
leadersofleaders
Today you scored 10 on leadership and and yesterday scored 9 and you know so great job. But then oh tomorrow oh you scored 8 all you're you're doing horrible. It's it's not like that. there's there's intangibles there's qualitative metrics that aren't as easy to measure. Um.

40:24.39
William
Right now.

40:38.49
leadersofleaders
But you allude to this possibility of being able to measure the intangible. So then how I mean how is that Even how is that even a possibility.

40:49.81
William
I think I think you're right, There is a subjective element to leadership and so often I hear people use that as an excuse and say well you really can't measure this you really can't measure what we do? Um I think often that's just lazy thinking.

40:55.31
leadersofleaders
A.

41:02.86
leadersofleaders
A.

41:04.96
William
Um, if we if we pursue it The fact of the matter is you and I measure what matters we know that we measure what matters you don't just like keep writing checks out of your checking account without ever knowing what's in there right? you measure what matters if you do that you're going to have a problem.

41:07.80
leadersofleaders
And.

41:19.97
leadersofleaders
I mean it would be pretty cool if great if it was endless I Mean of course I would but it's not unfortunately. Um.

41:22.27
William
Yeah, that'd be kind of cool but that's right I That's right, but it's not that's right, We measure what matters and so I think this is a case where where're leaders and what I coach leaders to do is is to be very intentional about the measurements that you're going to take um.

41:37.52
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, no.

41:40.21
William
What are you measuring because that that's that's what matters. Um, let's take let's take your personal growth and development. What are some ways that you can grow and develop as a leader you mentioned books. Okay, books that you read make a difference. You know it's been said many times by many different people. Ah, you know you will be the same person 5 years from now that you are today because of the people around you and the books that you read. Ah, that's what makes the difference I just completely screwed that quote up but you know what I'm saying you'll be the same person except for the books that you read and the people that you choose to spend time with.

42:08.17
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And yeah, the but yeah.

42:18.47
William
Um, this is this is the power of learning and growth. We get to decide that I decide the books that I read So what books am I going to choose to read I'm going to determine the books I read and I'm going to determine how many books I read and how much time I've been reading them.

42:21.92
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

42:27.83
leadersofleaders
Yeah.

42:36.60
William
Well I don't have time I'm too busy. Okay I'll match your schedule for schedule. Let's go. We prioritize what matters we prioritize what matters in our lives and if I've got to give up a little sleep to get better as a leader I'm gonna do that.

42:40.20
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, exactly yeah.

42:55.57
leadersofleaders
Well, ah you ah you you already enticed me with ah your use of a chemical ah chemical word like Catalyst um and being catalytic. Ah, but then.

42:55.86
William
That's a choice.

43:12.46
leadersofleaders
Man I'm like I'm deeply in it now because intentionality and then and then you know we're we're Measuring. Um, but then we're and and so then we're evaluating and and we do measure what matters and. Yeah, and if if you choose Okay, your choices have consequences. So then right? and so it's like you choose books you choose you choose people or you choose you know none of the other or don't change it or whatever and then yeah and then you and then you don't change.

43:34.26
William
Yes, they do.

43:48.59
leadersofleaders
Right? And if you don't change it. Ah I would guess that it would you would probably be worse than mediocre because at least mediocre. Maybe they're given some of these things a shot. Maybe they're not doing a good job measuring it. Maybe they're not doing a good job evaluating it. You would become stagnant. No, there would be no.

44:03.62
William
Yeah.

44:07.90
leadersofleaders
Ah, possibility for any catalyst in your life. Let alone you to be a catalyst in anybody else's life um man that that yeah so I was already I was already pretty pumped but now like be beyond pumped and so you you have 12 is.

44:26.17
William
Gap. Yeah.

44:26.37
leadersofleaders
12 principles am I saying that right 12 principles or 2 Yeah, so 12 principles in this book and 12 is kind of a lot. Um, but but um, but a manageable a lot. You know there's there's significance there with the the 12 disciples right? There's significance like that was a lot.

44:32.54
William
It is.

44:45.97
leadersofleaders
Ah, but there's a manageable if if you were to if you were to go okay Let's go let's go core let's go you know Peter right? and John like ah so what? what would be and and we can finish out the show I think with this what would be like okay here's. Here's the core things and here's where you can go to find out more about how to implement this how to measure this how to how to make these things matter how to evaluate? Um, where you're at and where you're going and start start doing the work that it will take. To gain the skill that we can gain that is leadership and more importantly, being a catalytic leader.

45:33.21
William
I'm glad you said that Aaron it's important not to get overwhelmed by by looking and thinking twelve things I can't focus on 12 things. You're absolutely right? You can't focus on 12 things. Neither can I what what I do with the the clients that I work with that I coach.

45:35.54
leadersofleaders
A.

45:49.68
William
Is we're goingnna choose a handful of things right? We're gonna choose 3 or 4 that we're gonna focus on during the time that we're gonna be working together and we're gonna dive deep on those things right? and this is a very customized process that I do with the people that I coach.

45:56.72
leadersofleaders
A.

46:07.12
William
Because I want to address what they're dealing with and so it's not these three for everybody or these four for everybody now. It's gonna be depending on what you do how you lead where you want to grow. What's your areas of struggle. How are you wired like all of that factors in. Um.

46:11.85
leadersofleaders
Okay, okay, yeah, like it.

46:25.82
William
Ah, will tell you there are certain things that I will deal with everyone on one is the teachable spirit. Um, the hard truth is if if somebody is talking with me about coaching and they don't have a teachable spirit. Um, where that's not going to work I'm not gonna take them on as a client not because I don't love them in Jesus.

46:28.44
leadersofleaders
A a.

46:39.20
leadersofleaders
A.

46:45.94
William
But because if you don't have a teachable spirit. This isn't gonna help you and ah, you're not I'm not I mean that we're just not. We're not gonna do that So this it's not. It's not gonna be a win for everybody. Um, that's that's a non-negotiable. You've got to have a teachable spirit That's that is.

46:49.42
leadersofleaders
Yeah, well, you're not going to learn anything from me. Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah, ah.

46:57.89
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

47:02.76
William
Simply the bottom line so that's that's why that's the first chapter in the book because that's the one non-negotiable. The next thing that I work with everyone on is discovering their own wiring. Every leader is wired a little bit differently and when we're young leaders and we're just getting started. Our tendency is to try to.

47:13.59
leadersofleaders
Um.

47:21.93
William
Pretend or copy another leader right? We pretend we're like another leader we copy another leader I've even seen people like copy the style of dress and and the way they talk you know and and that's that's how we all start. That's how we all begin because that's how you learn you begin to figure out what fits what doesn't but if you.

47:23.50
leadersofleaders
A.

47:30.92
leadersofleaders
A a.

47:41.41
William
Stay there then what you end up becoming is a bad copy of a great leader instead of leaning into your wiring the way God designed and created you to lead and what I want to do is help leaders discover how they are wired and so that's something that I work with everybody on. We're going to discover that for you.

47:45.41
leadersofleaders
A.

47:56.63
leadersofleaders
Um, yeah.

48:00.52
William
You know we're going to take some some personality inventories and profiles and use some tools to discover your wiring your bent so that you can lead authentically from that instead of thinking you have to be like somebody else or or you know well a leader looks like this So I've got to be that and you know a leader looks like you.

48:07.75
leadersofleaders
M.

48:20.21
William
God gifted and calleds you to lead he intended you to lead from your wiring. So let's figure that out and start from there I'm gonna do that with everybody we're gonna discover our wiring and lead from there. What's next what are some other principles you know and again these are going to be different for for each one. Um.

48:24.73
leadersofleaders
And yeah.

48:39.59
William
But one that that is a recurring theme that I will that I'll be pretty consistent with people about is you have to make a daily choice to Pursue intentional growth as a leader this goes beyond the posture of learning this is having a plan to grow.

48:51.73
leadersofleaders
Yes.

48:59.32
William
Having to plan to grow as a leader. What is your development plan I'm gonna help you develop that I'm gonna help you put that together. You're gonna you're gonna have a plan that will serve you the rest of your life. You can take and adjust and adapt and pivot as you need to, but this becomes the the roadm map if you will but you got to have that and too many leaders. Don't.

49:03.93
leadersofleaders
Um.

49:16.47
leadersofleaders
So.

49:18.96
William
And and they find themselves 10 or 15 or thirty years into their leadership journey and they they're like well I don't really I really wound up anywhere. Well it's because you didn't you didn't follow a road. You didn't follow a path you just kind of meandered. Um, you don't end up where you want to go accidentally.

49:25.91
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, unless it's a miracle. So very, very, very very.

49:37.96
William
Ah, you have to choose to do that on purpose and and this is right right? right? I'm not going to presume on God like that he gave us. He gave us a brain and he intends us to use it. Um, and this is.

49:44.14
leadersofleaders
Seldom exception to the very very very solid role right? Yeah yeah, no exactly? Well yeah, brain and a body. Yeah.

49:57.84
William
And this is Aaron this is why I've had a coach for years I've had a leadership coach for years because I can't see what I can't see in my own life I need somebody to help me see what I can't see you. You can't see the whole thing. You can't see the whole picture when you're in the frame.

50:02.17
leadersofleaders
Yeah, okay.

50:05.42
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, exactly hundred percent yeah

50:16.17
William
And and that's why I need somebody from the outside who's going to ask me questions that maybe nobody else asked me. It's going to help me see the blind spots that I don't even know are there. That's the power and the value of a coach from the outside who's going to do that for you. That's why I do this for others because I think it matters I think it's important.

50:19.42
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

50:33.30
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, so yeah, so so obviously top shelf. Best. Ah.

50:35.71
William
Um, but it is very customized. You know for the for the individual leader.

50:45.14
leadersofleaders
Best way for for me to really jump into becoming a cat leader. Hey let's get William ataway as my coach and and hit the ground running right? or at least get the rubber on the road right? Ah and maybe even create a road if I don't have 1

51:01.95
William
Absolutely.

51:04.41
leadersofleaders
From how they're spinning donuts in the in the field. Ah um, literally and figuratively. Maybe you know I don't know. Ah so so but like you said obviously it's gonna it's going to depend um on the personality which totally makes sense right? Some of us are.

51:08.44
William
Ah, yeah, yeah.

51:23.62
leadersofleaders
Like like you said meeting people where they're at it like yeah maybe I'm here and okay I don't need XY and z but I do need pd and q um right? and and that totally makes sense so what? if just do a ah quick one here. Um, and then I think we can close out so what? if okay I I want to kick the tires. Um, on.

51:28.93
William
Exactly.

51:43.15
leadersofleaders
This very interesting perspective and author that is William Addaway I got I got his book would the book help me be able to choose you know, hey, let's focus on the the most important things first. Is it written in in that way or is it like hey here they are and then and then maybe okay, let's work on this and then we'll work on that and then we'll work on that and and some of these things might just come quicker like how how would I how would I navigate that if I was sans personal coach William madaway.

52:16.38
William
Yeah, no, it's a fair question and I think the the reason that I wrote the book was to capture a lot of these principles that that I've learned and that I've coached other leaders in to make them accessible to as many leaders as possible. The fact is not everybody is going to hire me as their leadership and executive coach.

52:19.68
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah.

52:24.22
leadersofleaders
And yeah, love it? Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, right.

52:36.12
William
That's okay I can't have everybody as a client I would I don't have enough hours in the day right? So the book gives me and an ability to share right? That's right? but the the book gives me that's right, It's not a good fit. Yeah, um, the book gives me the opportunity to share.

52:43.35
leadersofleaders
I Don't even want everybody as a client like no I don't I don't want that person. Ah.

52:53.87
William
You know what? God's given me the privilege to learn you know in my own journey and from others to share that with a much broader audience who can benefit from it. The the book is written in such a way that it what what I had in mind when I was writing it was I want this to feel like you and I are sitting across a table having coffee and we're just talking.

52:54.37
leadersofleaders
I.

53:07.80
leadersofleaders
A love it. Maybe nice.

53:11.60
William
It to be incredibly conversational. So that's how I wrote it and there are things throughout the book that are very actionable things that you can take and do something with I don't want this to be just theoretical. You know up in the clouds and yeah, what do I do with that. You know this is this very practical things that you can take and and implement.

53:28.11
leadersofleaders
M.

53:30.61
William
Um, the the key and this is this is important is that's only going to take you so far, you know it's like ah it's like ah a Youtube video people want to run to Youtube and you know grab a whole lot of information and learning and that's incredibly helpful. Um, but it's not going to take the place of you know, an academic program of study.

53:33.82
leadersofleaders
Yeah, Absolutely yeah. So.

53:50.20
William
You know you're not going to learn everything. There is to know about chemistry from Youtube all right. It's it's if you want to become a pharmacist. You're going to need to go take chemistry classes and learn from people who are further down the road than you are who can coach you and mentor you and that's what I do in that vein. So.

53:50.22
leadersofleaders
Yep. No.

53:58.90
leadersofleaders
M.

54:04.77
leadersofleaders
Yep.

54:07.67
William
You know the book is a great introduction and it's a great way to get people started where they can start taking action but understand it's only going to take you so far and there comes a point where you're going to need somebody whether it's me or somebody else to come alongside you and help you take the steps the secret sauce of coaching.

54:13.62
leadersofleaders
Yep.

54:19.42
leadersofleaders
A. Love it? yeah yeah I mean New Year's resolutions have become a joke and a meme at this point. So.

54:25.32
William
Is accountability. We have so often. Wonderful intentions. But we find ourselves with those same intentions a year later and two years later and five years later who's the oh. Absolutely. Absolutely. Who's gonna hold you to what you say you're gonna do and this is what I do for my clients. The last time we met you said you were gonna do x y and z have you done that well I've been real busy and and and I'm just gonna hit look at you for a minute then we're gonna talk about. Okay, do you really want this area.

54:43.97
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

54:59.48
leadersofleaders
Like ah.

55:02.66
leadersofleaders
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

55:02.80
William
To grow and to change or do you want to keep getting the results. You've been getting you get to decide and and by holding you accountable What I'm gonna do is I'm gonna help you make the decision that you already want to make and you know you need to make that is the beauty and the power of a coach.

55:18.14
leadersofleaders
Yeah, hundred percent

55:21.40
William
I'm not giving you all the answers I'm simply helping you take the steps that you know you need to make.

55:26.41
leadersofleaders
Yeah I love it. That's well so um, for those of you that are listening if you haven't already purchased the book I don't know what you're doing go on get the book. Ah catalytic leadership. Um, what's the book's title again.

55:44.20
William
Catalytic leadership and Aaron I'll I'll tell you for your podcast listeners I would love to extend this offer if they will go to catalyticleadershipbook.comthey can get a copy for free. All all they have to do is pay the shipping so I can get it to them.

55:44.58
leadersofleaders
I've yeah so. Okay. Oh dang. Nice.

56:00.93
William
Want to get this book into the hands of as many leaders and potential leaders and emerging leaders as I can. That's my goal because I want other people to benefit from what I've had the incredible opportunity to learn in my own journey and from others. So if they go to Catalyticleadershipbook.com they pay the shipping. We'll get a copy of that book right out tool.

56:22.46
leadersofleaders
Well I ah I'm doing that right now or in I'm gonna hit stop recorded that I'm going to do that. Um, and then so secondarily if if and when you get this book I should say when you get this book. Check it out kick the tires on it if this is speaking your language then what are you doing make it a coach make like that's that's where I mean to me that's where the rubber really meets the road like you said. You know if you don't have that accountability cool. You got 12 principles. But if you're not putting them into action then what? what are you doing? Why did you get the book in the first place why you know Um, so ah, thank you so much for having on the show. Thank you so much for ah following my weird thoughtline where I was jumping kind of all over the place because I wanted to know. Ah, couple of nuancey weird things that weren't really in line with the becoming a catalytic leader but the lion's share of the show was definitely I think helpful for me and helpful for any of the listeners if they are in pursuit of becoming intentional. Being intentionally that catalytic leader. So. Thank you so much William for hopping on the show is an honor and a pleasure.

57:34.92
William
Aaron it's been a joy to be with you. Thanks so much for having me and I do hope this was hopeful.